P
paul turbine
I think it is possible to design a machine capable of generating useful electricity via recirculated fluid flow. But the laws of thermodynamics make it very difficult.
The three laws of thermodynamics may be summarized by saying: "You can break even but only at absolute zero".
So we know for sure we will never be able to get more energy out of a system than we put into it in the first place.
Secondly, the value of entropy in any system governs what is possible or impossible.
If entropy is zero or negative, then whatever we hoped to achieve is impossible. It is simply not permitted in this universe by the laws of physics that govern it.
An example would be trying to reverse the act of smashing an egg on the floor. Any such reversal of the egg breaking process would require a value for entropy (S) which was negative. Accordingly, we know the proposed act to be impossible.
Unfortunately, the laws of thermodynamics and the related law concerning entropy reflect reality. If we don't like it, we must go and live in another universe.
Bearing in mind the laws we are stuck with, the next step is to consider what type of system might be useful bearing in mind these significant limitations.
There are three types of system. Isolated systems, closed systems and open systems.
In isolated systems, neither mass nor energy may pass through the system boundaries (think of a perfectly insulated thermos flask).
Needless to say, we will never be able to generate useful electricity from an isolated system because for a start we will never be able to get any energy out of it in the first place.
So we can forget about isolated systems right away.
Then there are Closed systems. They allow energy to pass through the system boundaries, but prevent mass passing through the boundaries.
Again the laws of thermodynamics prevent useful electricity being generated using a closed system, because you will always get less energy out of a closed system then you put into it in the first place.
Our only hope is to use an open system.
The laws of thermodynamics will only ever allow us to generate useful electricity using systems in which both mass and energy can pass through the system boundaries.
So this has to be our starting point.
We must invent a machine (an open system) that allows mass (for example water and/or compressed air) to pass in and out of the system boundaries, and which also allows energy to pass in and out of the system boundaries.
In practical terms this means we need help from the environment.
External work must be done on the system (eg solar energy or water from a flowing stream) to provide energy from outside the system boundary)and also external mass (for example air or water) from outside the system boundary must be able to pass through the boundaries as well.
The best idea I have come up with began as a mathematical thought experiment:
There are two 25m high cylinders each of diameter 1m.
An impulse turbine (for example a Pelton turbine) has been placed 3m from the bottom of the second cylinder (allowing a space beneath it for tailgate water to accumulate).
I think I have found a way to connect these cylinders in such a way that fluid can circulate from cylinder A into cylinder B allowing it to flow down a 20m+ drop in cylinder B before striking the impulse turbine.
At a mass flow rate of one cubic meter per second (which is an enormous flow rate)and allowing for system efficiency of 0.85 (this being a unit-less fraction where 0= total inefficiency and
1= perfect efficiency), the electrical power output in watts (using water as the working fluid) would be as follows:
Pw = 1000kg/m3 x 20m x 9.81 m/s/s x 0.85
Pw = 166770 watts = 166.77kW.
So this might look promising.
But there are serious practical problems.
The water that collects at the bottom of cylinder B (the tail-gate water) will rise until the point it prevents the impulse turbine turning. It will swamp the turbine and stop it moving.
However, I think I have found a way of recirculating fluid from cylinder A back into cylinder B without having to use enormous amounts of external energy (to lift or pump fluid back into tank B).
I would much appreciate private (not to be published) dialogue hopefully with a co-inventor familiar with thermodynamics, Bernoulli, and Newtonian fluid flows.
My aim is to share with a candidate co-inventor a recirculation novelty compliant with the laws of thermodynamics for the purpose of applying for a patent relating to industrial electricity generation.
I am only interested in applying for a patent if the model works mathematically.
Thank you for reading this post.
I can be contacted at:
[email protected]
The three laws of thermodynamics may be summarized by saying: "You can break even but only at absolute zero".
So we know for sure we will never be able to get more energy out of a system than we put into it in the first place.
Secondly, the value of entropy in any system governs what is possible or impossible.
If entropy is zero or negative, then whatever we hoped to achieve is impossible. It is simply not permitted in this universe by the laws of physics that govern it.
An example would be trying to reverse the act of smashing an egg on the floor. Any such reversal of the egg breaking process would require a value for entropy (S) which was negative. Accordingly, we know the proposed act to be impossible.
Unfortunately, the laws of thermodynamics and the related law concerning entropy reflect reality. If we don't like it, we must go and live in another universe.
Bearing in mind the laws we are stuck with, the next step is to consider what type of system might be useful bearing in mind these significant limitations.
There are three types of system. Isolated systems, closed systems and open systems.
In isolated systems, neither mass nor energy may pass through the system boundaries (think of a perfectly insulated thermos flask).
Needless to say, we will never be able to generate useful electricity from an isolated system because for a start we will never be able to get any energy out of it in the first place.
So we can forget about isolated systems right away.
Then there are Closed systems. They allow energy to pass through the system boundaries, but prevent mass passing through the boundaries.
Again the laws of thermodynamics prevent useful electricity being generated using a closed system, because you will always get less energy out of a closed system then you put into it in the first place.
Our only hope is to use an open system.
The laws of thermodynamics will only ever allow us to generate useful electricity using systems in which both mass and energy can pass through the system boundaries.
So this has to be our starting point.
We must invent a machine (an open system) that allows mass (for example water and/or compressed air) to pass in and out of the system boundaries, and which also allows energy to pass in and out of the system boundaries.
In practical terms this means we need help from the environment.
External work must be done on the system (eg solar energy or water from a flowing stream) to provide energy from outside the system boundary)and also external mass (for example air or water) from outside the system boundary must be able to pass through the boundaries as well.
The best idea I have come up with began as a mathematical thought experiment:
There are two 25m high cylinders each of diameter 1m.
An impulse turbine (for example a Pelton turbine) has been placed 3m from the bottom of the second cylinder (allowing a space beneath it for tailgate water to accumulate).
I think I have found a way to connect these cylinders in such a way that fluid can circulate from cylinder A into cylinder B allowing it to flow down a 20m+ drop in cylinder B before striking the impulse turbine.
At a mass flow rate of one cubic meter per second (which is an enormous flow rate)and allowing for system efficiency of 0.85 (this being a unit-less fraction where 0= total inefficiency and
1= perfect efficiency), the electrical power output in watts (using water as the working fluid) would be as follows:
Pw = 1000kg/m3 x 20m x 9.81 m/s/s x 0.85
Pw = 166770 watts = 166.77kW.
So this might look promising.
But there are serious practical problems.
The water that collects at the bottom of cylinder B (the tail-gate water) will rise until the point it prevents the impulse turbine turning. It will swamp the turbine and stop it moving.
However, I think I have found a way of recirculating fluid from cylinder A back into cylinder B without having to use enormous amounts of external energy (to lift or pump fluid back into tank B).
I would much appreciate private (not to be published) dialogue hopefully with a co-inventor familiar with thermodynamics, Bernoulli, and Newtonian fluid flows.
My aim is to share with a candidate co-inventor a recirculation novelty compliant with the laws of thermodynamics for the purpose of applying for a patent relating to industrial electricity generation.
I am only interested in applying for a patent if the model works mathematically.
Thank you for reading this post.
I can be contacted at:
[email protected]